Tom Sutton

You said "internally illuminated exit boxes are usually needed" my argument is they should not be, if building control required them, it would not be in accordance with the guidance but could be for compensatory reasons and I cannot imagine what those would be. If companies wish to install them, when they are not needed, then that is up to them, but if they are being told they have to install them they should investigate to ensure they are not being ripped off.

AB what legal requirement requires internal illuminated exit signs in supermarkets, yes for premises that the normal lighting is extinguisher, during the time the premises are occupied, like cinemas, theatres, clubs and places of public entertainment, but not normal commercial premises, I would be interested to know.

Further to the above I believe your statement "the phrase 'linked alarm system' I mean sounders in the sleeping accommodation linked to detectors in the commercial premises" should read "linked to only heat detectors in the commercial premises" you have to consider false alarms, too many would render the system a liability.

Are you testing the domestic smoke alarms in each flat or are they heat detectors in each flat connected to a communal fire alarm?

In supermarkets I think it is acceptable to use photo illuminated ISO 7010 fire exit signs or even standard ISO 7010 fire exit signs providing they are well illuminated by the normal and emergency lighting.

You are quite correct, if it is not being used to garage a car then it is not a garage and the rule about a full FD30s between the the house and garage does not apply. I believe because a garage houses a car which rely on flammable liquids, it's a high fire risk and the means of escape from the house must have a higher degree of protection.

Have you checked the tenants agreement to see if there is anything relating to this matter giving you access. Have you checked the fire risk assessment (FRA) to see if these exits are required for means of escape.

Are these doors used by anybody as normal entrance/exit or are they purely emergency exit doors.

I fully agree roger but if the meter cupboard is in the communal area it will still need to meet a full 30 minutes fire resistance, so all above still applies.

Have you checked out Rock Mineral Wool Slabs they could be glued to the upper side of the hatch or fixed in some other way.

I am assuming it is a purpose build block therefore you should study Fire safety in purpose-built blocks of flats which has guidance to answer your question. Your understanding is correct to some degree but you need to check the finer details A6.28 would be a place to start and there is guidance on fire alarms as well.

All doors opening onto a protected escape route should be a full FD30s doors if there is a fire risk in the room, and a heat detector should fitted in the risk room. Maybe if the fire door has been installed some considerable time, it could be a BS 476 part 8 door, which can be identified by having 25mm rebates with no intumescent seals, which if the door is substantial and well fitting can be accepted as suitable, but if it needs replacing it has to be replaced with a fire door meeting the current standards. Either case it needs to control cold smoke and cold smoke seals should be fitted.

I am assuming the flat owner is not a freeholder therefore the owners/freeholders of the building, as Responsible Persons, are responsible that all doors opening on to the communal areas meet the required standards. However any tenancy agreements should dictate who pays and how, usually through the service charge.

It seems to be a magnetic lock and if so it should meet the requirements of BS 7273 part 4 which would require a manual override. (green box)

Byrom I see the problem as the council are asking for a certificate that does not exist for a grade D system.

Assuming this door has be accessed and meets the standards of a nominal 30 min fire door then it would not require changing, it all depends on the fire risk assessment.

The Responsible Person has a duty to reduce any potential hazards to as low as possible if he/she cannot eradicate them. I am not aware of any legal methods to get him/her to change their minds other than persuasion. The main problem is if you ignore his/her directive and things go pear shaped he/she has a ready made patsy.

Under the Health and Safety at Work etc. Act 1974 the employer is required to produce a written statement of his general policy with respect to the health and safety at work of his employees, which in my interpretation is the occupational health and safety risk assessment. Under The Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005 the employer is required to conduct a fire risk assessment which can be included in the occupational health and safety risk assessment or separate if he/she chooses. Each piece of legislation requires different duties, the employer has to conform to and deal with different health and safety issues.

Does this door lead from a flat to the common area or does it divide the escape corridor?

Sustained emergency luminaire is an old fashion terminology, in BS 5266-1: 2016 the terms used now are Maintained fitting (M), Non-maintained fitting (NM), combined emergency luminaire M/NM, Compound self-contained emergency luminaire M/NM, and Satellite emergency luminaire is used and each luminaire can be NM or M. Maintained or non-maintained is the principal consideration, which is decided by the use of the premises. Maintained mode is generally used in places of assembly such as theatres, cinemas, clubs and halls. The lights are typically dimmed when these premises are occupied and the emergency escape lighting prevents total darkness. Maintained fire exit signs are also used in public spaces even where these are well lit to offer clear escape route guidance in evacuation situations where the power does not fail. Non-maintained emergency luminaire: a luminaire whose emergency lamps only come on when the power supply to the normal lighting fails. Non-maintained is the typical mode in a workplace or similar environment in which artificial lighting is normally deployed while the premises are occupied. Combined emergency luminaire: a luminaire containing two or more lamps, at least one of which is energized from the emergency lighting supply and the other(s) from the normal lighting supply. A combined emergency luminaire can be either maintained or non-maintained. Compound self-contained emergency luminaire: a luminaire providing maintained or non-maintained emergency lighting and also the emergency power supply to a satellite luminaire. Satellite emergency luminaire: a luminaire for maintained or non-maintained operation and which derives its emergency operation supply from an associated compound self-contained emergency luminaire. Check out https://www.firesafe.org.uk/emergency-lighting/ or the British Standard 5266 part 1 2016.

Thanks AB

I fully understand that AB but what I do not understand why a Grade A in a two storey premises I do not think Lacots would agree.

I suspect it the Responsible Person considers it a trip hazard not a fire hazard and in my opinion it should be risk assessed, sometimes it is a problem other times it is not. It is enforceable but I would imagine it is unlikely the enforcing authority would take action but you never know.

If it is well serviced it would be normal but if it is the damage by a fire it could lose data which could be vital to the owner and could be catastrophic.

Could you give the details of the type of fire alarm are you talking about.