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  2. I am not aware of any guidance on that particular situation, however BS 9990 says it should be fitted on an external wall and in most buildings I have had dealing with, they usually located in a reasonable large protected lobby. In my opinion the refuge is irrelevant, as the refuge is for a short term stay and should be cleared before the arrival of the FRS. If the management fail in their duty then the first fire crews will remove ant disable people before the dry riser is used.
  3. Any covering across the exit route that inhibits the means of escape, needs careful consideration, for instance door curtains in theatres or cinemas are not recommended, (places of assembly). However it is about fire risk assessment and you have to decide to what degree the MoE will be inhibited and what degree of hazard will exist. Without seeing the door and as you say "the signage being out of sight and the blind blocking the exit in a panic situation" it appears not acceptable. Is it not possible to cover only the window itself?
  4. Guest

    Dry riser in refuge area

    I'm trying to find some guidance on dry riser outlets fitted in a protected lobby of hotel with refuge area?
  5. It is recommended by BS 8214 that overpainting be limited to a maximum of five coats of conventional oil-bound paint or varnish.This applies to intumescent seals but I believe it would also apply to the door in general. When preparing a frame for redecorating, the use of heat or chemical strippers should be avoided if intumescent seals are incorporated. If seals are damaged by either of these processes, they should be replaced. If glazing beads have been painted with intumescent paint, it is essential that they be repainted with a similar paint. Consequently if you stay within the above guidance and if you strip the door first I would imagine you could easily achieve these recommendations.
  6. Simple answer usually yes (unless the manufacturer of the doorset states that frame and door combination can tolerate a larger gap and still perform correctly). Are they closing in a rebate and do they have intumescent seals?
  7. Which country - Scotland, England or Wales? Do you occupy the flat or let it out? Do they want the systems in each flat linked to each other or not? This will assist in replying. Whilst there are no communal areas and the Fire Safety Order does not apply the Housing Act does and this does include the ability to require fire safety improvements inside a flat.
  8. As a joint freeholder I would suspect you are liable for your share of costs - the applicability of the Fire Safety Order to your flat isn't the issue, it's more a property law issue vis a vis the liabilities as a joint freeholder - the freeholder is responsible for the managmeent of the communal space and associated costs be it fire safety or any more general maintenance and as you are one of them (& possibly as a result a director of the TMC if there is one??) you could be liable for your share of the cost.
  9. No internal communal space by the sounds of it so no.
  10. I am selling a freehold to a victorian house conversion of two flats to the two leaseholders. The downstairs is accessed by a front door and the rear flat is access by its own front door via a staircase. Does this require a fire risk assessment? Thanks in advance
  11. I own a garden/basement flat in a four storey Victorian house. It is entirely self-contained with its own private garden and private entrance with a rear door to the enclosed patio garden I have no access to the common areas that the other residents need to gain entrance: a stone staircase, a front door and a common hallway. I am also a joint freeholder. The 1st floor flat is owned by a non-resident freeholder who is also a private sector landlord. After a small electrical fire in the flat above me, attended by the local Fire and Rescue, I wrote to the local council expressing concerns about the fire risks in this flat and requesting an inspection, having previously written to the owner who did not reply. As it happened the local Fire and Rescue had also contacted the local council. As a result of this I have been told by my council that, as a freeholder, I must contribute towards an expensive fire alarm system circa £3000. In their letter they quote the relevant paragraph from LACORS guide but have added words of their own in respect of whose responsibility this is vis a vis " to include the basement flat". As I understand the FRR Act 2005 it is only common areas that are subject to the act and furthermore that it is because the middle flat is let these fire alarms are needed. More alarming still is the demand from the absent freeholder, who is the private landlord of the middle flat, that I pay towards a £6500 bill from UK Power to install a "landlord's meter " with a separate electricity supply which would require the excavation of the large concrete area in front of the house which I own. I contend that as I have no access to common areas, do not even have a key to the main front door, and have a private entrance and rear exit my flat is completely safe. I am awaiting a meeting with my solicitors but would welcome any input from this forum. Thank you.
  12. Guest

    Smoke alarms in self-contained flats

    Hi. I am new to this but hope you can help. We own the freehold of a converted Edwardian building- two flats. One is owned by someone and we own the other. The flat needs work on it and the council have said we need hard-wired interlinking smoke alarms to both flats. There are no communal areas at all. Do we need to and who pays for the electric? Does anyone know. Thank you.
  13. Guest

    Gaps of fire door

    Hello i have numerous fire doors across and estate of properties I manage. A number of the doors are single doors fitted into a door frame that has smoke seals at the top and down both sides. The question I have is does the 3mm rule apply to the door in terms of gap between door and frame. The door itself sites in the frame and no day light can be seen. I would say the gaps are between 5mm and 8mm. Although a gap is there the door does close itself correctly and sits against the frame. The understanding is the seals would still work in a fire environment and close up the gap between door and frame I understand the gap needs to be closed up for double doors that meet but when it comes to a single door in a door frame I am not sure thanks ben
  14. I agree that the smoke detector is a little over the top and I would not usually make such a recommendation. My concern is that some of the significant findings I have raised were raised 8 years ago by another assessor and by the fire and rescue authority and they’ve not been actioned. With regard to Detection, I suppose it would have to be a Grade D LD2 System although I wouldn’t want Detection in the means of escape as I feel this could be detrimental to the safety of tenants in event of any fire in the escape route. I do appreciate its not an ideal situation and I’m not overly comfortable with it myself and I hope they carry out all other recommendations to further reduce the need for such detection. With regard to checks, I have recommended periodic checks as per the ‘fire safety in purpose built blocks of flats’ to include checking the operation of final exit doors and electromagnetic devices, Visual check of any Communal fire doors and nominal flat entrance fire doors for signs of damage and to ensure housekeeping is monitored.
  15. Can i paint my art room door with water based emulsion paints, (replicating Van Gogh's 'Starry Night') without impacting on fire safety?
  16. Being cynical is a good trait for a fire risk assessor in the past I have trusted those in control of the money and been let down, worst of all, if things had gone pear shaped, I know who would have been hung up to dry. I am not sure about the smoke detector in the cupboard, what type of system are you going to install, it could be fraught with problems. Although fire safety checks would be ideal to my knowledge it is not common, and the FRS inspecting officers rely on regular FRA's to maintain standards.
  17. Furniture within chalet hotels and holiday apartments is a grey area. Whilst holiday apartments and houses are specifically covered by the FFFSR, hotels are not and are covered by the Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005 which governs the fire safety of non-domestic premises. Some areas such as holiday camps and chalet hotels straddle both sectors and it is, therefore, difficult to give clear guidance. As a minimum it is recommended that the level of safety should not be less than that required by the Regulations. It appears it is subject to the FFFSR so check out Fire safety of furniture and furnishings in the home - A Guide to the UK Regulations guide 2 page 20 so cushion pads for domestic purposes would be acceptable.
  18. Hi, on inspecting a Emergency Exit door there is a blind present covering the whole door (to block out sunlight). Understandably this is in place due to a school classroom to block out sun but what is the clarification on A the signage being out of sight and B the blind blocking the exit in a panic situation?
  19. Just a quick fire regs question for summer lets and cushions - I’m planning to make some new cushions for our summer let soda and noticed on a cushion filler/pad site that they sell cushion pads for both domestic and commercial purposes As it is a commercial summer let am I not allowed to buy the cushion pads for domestic purposes ? many thanks for you help in this matter
  20. Hi Tom, Thank you for the response, it’s great to know there are like-minded people who simply want to create a responsible fire safety culture and attitude. Thats what I thought with regard to the meter cupboards With regard to the flat entrance doors, I’ve been told a fire door inspector is being bought in to carry out a 100% check of our doors, all of which are composite. The company I work for are requesting that, as they are doing this, that I remove the flat entrance doors as a significant finding and place it somewhere else in the report as an advisory without a risk rating / timescale attached, which to be honest I won’t be doing as I’ve got no confidence in the doors having taken a look at them and I would rather they weren’t ‘buried’ in the report. This is another reason why I will be recommending a smoke detector in the meter cupboard also, unfortunately some of our blocks have historical issues with regard to housekeeping, storage and smoking within the block, we’re lucky if the door handles are still intact at the time of the FRA! Just to add to that, many of our blocks are never subject to fire safety checks to ensure that final exit doors work, housekeeping is to a good standard etc. (Another recommendation that’s been disputed 🙄) Appreciate the advice Tom.
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  22. Check out https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/8079/Determination_on_the_suitability_and_sufficiency_of_a_fire_risk_assessment_in_a_hotel....pdf and Fire safety in purpose-built blocks of flats says a similar situation could apply to flats. (page 98, 62.17)
  23. All timber based fire doors tested to BS 476 - 22 and EN 1634-1 'currently' have intumescent fire seals. As an inspector I would always recommend existing / older timber-based fire doors should be fitted with seals. I do this on the basis that: 1) The building operator has a legal duty to take 'reasonable precautions' and keep fire doors in 'efficient' working order under the RR(FS)O. 2) The upgrading work is reasonably simple and cost effective. 3) Intumescent seals have proven evidence in tests in contributing to the fire separation performance of timber-based fire doors. If a client then decided not to fit the seals to existing / older doors, then its a matter for them and their fire strategy and fire risk assessment. They should justify their decision.
  24. I am assuming you want to fit a piece of plywood in the space above a fire door and the ceiling, I suppose to use as a sign. Has the caretaker explained why it is against fire safety rules?
  25. Not very long ago a landlord and a fire risk assessor was jailed for not producing an adequate FRA I would suggest you include in your FRA all items you consider a significant finding, if the RP considers them not to be, it is up to him/her to ignore it. Deciding if a fire door meets the required standard is not easy, if you do not have written documentation, you could conduct research in this area, or get a FDIS inspector to provide it, but unfortunately it will cost. Because of the location of the meter cupboard it should be enclosed to a FR standard and the fire door fitted with a lock, with appropriate signs fitted. If the tenants keep leaving it open then explain to them, the dangers of arson and the possibility their escape route, in a fire, could be impassable, try to educate them.
  26. Hi Harry, Thanks for your response, although I don't think the accessory would work on the active leaf of our door - as there is no bolt mechanism, just the latch shown in the photos. I have found a latch-mechanism active leaf pushbar with a hold-back facility elsewhere and will get this to replace the existing push bar. Thanks for your help tho. Cheers, Max
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