HMO or not??

[ChrisB]

Hello,

I am living in an ordinary Victorian house in London converted in the 1980s into 5 flats. One is a garden flat and the other 4 have a common entrance. We are all leaseholders except one (which shares the common entrance) where the leaseholder has rented the flat. The management company is insisting we need a fire alarm, extinguishers etc but I'm not sure that this is true.It is all domestic accommodation.

Do you think we are an HMO?

Regards

Chris

[Tom Sutton]

Hello,

I am living in an ordinary Victorian house in London converted in the 1980s into 5 flats. One is a garden flat and the other 4 have a common entrance. We are all leaseholders except one (which shares the common entrance) where the leaseholder has rented the flat. The management company is insisting we need a fire alarm, extinguishers etc but I'm not sure that this is true.It is all domestic accommodation.

Do you think we are an HMO?

Regards

Chris

Go to http://www.firesafe.org.uk/houses-in-multiple-occupation/ this my help.

[Tom Sutton]

Further to my above posting I should say even if you premises is not a HMO then the common parts are still subject to the Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005. This means the common parts require a fire risk assessment and this is maybe what the landlord has done and is implementing the findings of the fire risk assessment.

[Guest Ryan Mcmullan]

The premises in question would not be classed as a HMO. Though because the building has been converted to self contained flats it may need an AFD system (class of which is dependant on height of building etc), emergency lighting etc. as stated within the LACoRS manual.The LACoRS manual would apply if :

The house or building converted into self-contained flats

when converted did not (and does not) meet

the building standards under the Building Regulations

1991

Whether the flat is freehold or leasehold is of no relevance, it only has a bearing on who the responsible person may be and not what regulations of standards may apply.

[Tom Sutton]

Whether the flat is freehold or leasehold is of no relevance, it only has a bearing on who the responsible person may be and not what regulations of standards may apply.

Whether the flat is freehold or leasehold does have relevance when deciding if a premises is a HMO. check out Housing Act 254 1c / 254 4a / 257 2b / 257 4a

In article 3 I do not see where freehold or leasehold has any relevance.

[Ryan Mcmullan]

Tom you have taken what I have said out of context, I am answering the question at hand. The basis of the question is whether or not they need to fit an AFD and her arguement being are the flats as a whole classed as a HMO, if the flats where all leashold this would not make the premises a HMO so it has no relevance!

[Tom Sutton]

Ryan first of all welcome, your presence is much appreciated.

Part of the question asked was, is the premises a HMO and it was not stated they were self-contained flats but like you I suspect they are and consequently not a HMO.

My point was when trying to establish if it is a HMO one of the details you need to establish is the tenancy and if a lease is for more than 21 years or owner occupied it is relevant.

Also I think Chris thought that if it wasn't a HMO then a fire risk assessment would not be required consequently I went on to say that although it is may not be a HMO it will still be subject to the RR(FS)O and a fire risk assessment on the premises common areas would be required.

Sorry to be pedantic but very rarely do you get all the information you require to give definitive response so I tend to point the questioner where they can find the answer and allow them work it out for themselves.

[Guest tedHarri]

Hi Can anyone please give short description when a housing is HMO or not?

[Tom Sutton]

I am afraid there is no such thing as short description on this subject the only person who can give definitive response to your question is the local housing department. But you could try http://www.firesafe....ple-occupation/ for some information and the flow chart tries to. HMO Definition

[Safelincs]

Hi Ted

HMO

House in multiple occupation, as defined in section 254 of the Housing Act 2004

Meaning of “house in multiple occupation” (please check at legilation.gov.uk for the latest version)

(1) For the purposes of this Act a building or a part of a building is a “house in multiple occupation” if—

(a) it meets the conditions in subsection (2) (“the standard test”);

(b ) it meets the conditions in subsection (3) (“the self-contained flat test”);

(c ) it meets the conditions in subsection (4) (“the converted building test”);

(d) an HMO declaration is in force in respect of it under section 255; or

(e) it is a converted block of flats to which section 257 applies.

(2) A building or a part of a building meets the standard test if—

(a) it consists of one or more units of living accommodation not consisting of a self-contained flat or flats;

(b ) the living accommodation is occupied by persons who do not form a single household (see section

258);

(c ) the living accommodation is occupied by those persons as their only or main residence or they are to

be treated as so occupying it (see section 259);

(d) their occupation of the living accommodation constitutes the only use of that accommodation;

(e) rents are payable or other consideration is to be provided in respect of at least one of those persons'

occupation of the living accommodation; and

(f) two or more of the households who occupy the living accommodation share one or more basic

amenities or the living accommodation is lacking in one or more basic amenities.

(3) A part of a building meets the self-contained flat test if—

(a) it consists of a self-contained flat; and

( b ) paragraphs ( b ) to (f) of subsection (2) apply (reading references to the living accommodation

concerned as references to the flat).

(4) A building or a part of a building meets the converted building test if—

(a) it is a converted building;

( b ) it contains one or more units of living accommodation that do not consist of a self-contained flat or

flats

(whether or not it also contains any such flat or flats);

(c ) the living accommodation is occupied by persons who do not form a single household (see section 258);

(d) the living accommodation is occupied by those persons as their only or main residence or they are to be

treated as so occupying it (see section 259);

(e) their occupation of the living accommodation constitutes the only use of that accommodation; and

(f) rents are payable or other consideration is to be provided in respect of at least one of those persons'

occupation of the living accommodation.

(5) But for any purposes of this Act (other than those of Part 1) a building or part of a building within

subsection (1) is not a house in multiple occupation if it is listed in Schedule 14.

(6) The appropriate national authority may by regulations—

(a) make such amendments of this section and sections 255 to 259 as the authority considers appropriate

with a view to securing that any building or part of a building of a description specified in the regulations

is or is not to be a house in multiple occupation for any specified purposes of this Act;

( b ) provide for such amendments to have effect also for the purposes of definitions in other enactments

that operate by reference to this Act;

(c ) make such consequential amendments of any provision of this Act, or any other enactment, as the

authority considers appropriate.

[Guest steveDill]

Please can you qualify for me where the regulations for a licensed HMO start and stop for fire detection between the use of part 6 mains interlinked detection and an L2 mains system under part 1

[Tom Sutton]

The enforcing authority for HMO's is the Local Housing Department and the regulation is the Housing Act 2004 but it doesn't dictate how the require standards are achieved that is up to the appropriate guidance. In most cases the LHA will accept the LACORS Guide for up to two story's, more than that you, will need to contact them because they may have their own guidance.

Check out www.gov.uk/house-in-multiple-occupation-licence